Why Phi? – a Mars-Earth model and more

Posted: March 27, 2015 by oldbrew in Celestial Mechanics, Cycles, Fibonacci, Phi, solar system dynamics
Tags: ,
Click on image to enlarge

Click on image to enlarge

The Mars-Earth model is based on 34 Mars orbits. This equates to 64 years, which is 8². Since Venus makes 13 orbits of Earth in 8 years, we can easily add it to the model.
2,3,5,8,13 and 34 are Fibonacci numbers.

The story doesn’t end there, because as the diagram shows this results in a 3:4:7 relationship between the 3 sets of synodic periods. This was analysed in detail in a paper by astrophysicist Ian Wilson, featured at the Talkshop in 2013:

Ian Wilson: Connecting the Planetary Periodicities to Changes in the Earth’s Length of Day

Wilson notes: ‘A remarkable near-resonance condition exists between the orbital motions of the three largest terrestrial planets with:

4 x sVe = 6.3946 years where sVe = synodic period of Venus and Earth
3 x seM = 6.4059 years seM = synodic period of Earth and Mars
7 x sVM = 6.3995 years and sVM = synodic period of Venus and Mars

This means that these three planets return to the same relative orbital configuration at a whole multiple of 6.40 years.’

The Mars-Earth model above reflects that near-resonance and shows a strong link to whole numbers of planetary orbits.
A close link also occurs with the long Inex period (521 years) that was recently discussed here:


…where we find with reference to Keeling and Whorf’s tidal cycles:
‘Figure 2 in the [K&W] paper shows two long tidal cycle periods of 1823 years each…
By adding these two periods together, plus one year, we get 7 sets of 18 Inex cycles (3647 years = 521y x 7)’

A quick check shows that 57 x 64 years = 3648 while 7 x 521 years = 3647 — i.e. one year less.

We now find that:
1939 (34 x 57, +1) Mars orbits = 3646.96 years
5928 (13 x 8 x 57) Venus orbits = 3646.89 years
3647 (64 x 57, -1) Earth orbits = 3647 years
— so we have strong matches to the 3647 years (7 x 521 years) Inex period there.

In this analysis Mars ‘gains’ one orbit and Earth ‘loses’ one compared to the model over the 3647 year period, while Venus orbits are ‘on target’. This shows how small the difference is between the original model (graphic above) and the likely reality.

Planetary data source: http://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/?planet_phys_par

  1. oldbrew says:

    There’s a numerical connection between the Inex eclipse and lunar node cycles, and the Mars-Earth-Venus near-resonance.

  2. Doug Proctor says:

    Are these various relationships, including the Fibonacci, reflect well-understood physics, the interactions of bodies in motion with gravitational fields, or do they (also?) suggest unknown connections outside of standard understandings of space-time?

  3. oldbrew says:

    Doug: Mean motion resonance is at least considered to exist – whether it’s ‘well understood’ is doubtful.


  4. Brian H says:

    How is this different from constructing a brass orrery?

  5. oldbrew says:

    An orrery doesn’t show a pattern, unless it’s short-term like the Galilean moons of Jupiter.

  6. stenies2012 says:

    Using gravity alone, as in the current models, would guarantee collision in almost all approaches, since gravity increases with decreasing distance. This is one of the many facts the current model fails to address. Given the current math, any resonance would be the precursor to an almost certain collision. Since the current model has many more resonances than it has collisions, it is immediately contradictory.

  7. stenies2012 says:

    What it is that causes Jupiter and Saturn to move apart after the closest part of their resonance, and keeps the close pass from becoming a collision?

  8. stenies2012 says:

    And finally…. how can gravity cause a resonance, by itself?

  9. oldbrew says:

    Ask Mathis why Jupiter’s moons are not arranged in order of size.

  10. stenies2012 says:

    Yes I guess everybody knows…

  11. oldbrew says:

    stenies: interesting blog post here…

    ‘observations from boreholes in South Africa indicated that “low water” occurs “at about the time of the moon’s transit” ‘


  12. stenies2012 says:

    Yea oldbrew well done for spotting it…btw great posts I read them all. Do you have an email?

    [reply] https://tallbloke.wordpress.com/portal/tt-admin-contact/

  13. P.A.Semi says:


    To note more: Jupiter/Saturn = 5/2 (3 meet points of 19.85 year average distance) are also at the start of Fibonacci sequence. (Other far planets are not in Fibonacci: Jup/Ura above 7/1, Jup/Nep below 14/1, Sat/Ura 20/7. Ura/Nep best near 51/26 (or 49/25 = (7/5)^2 …) – little below 2/1. the reason, why 7/1 and 14/1 are not exact and not on a same side is, that IF they were exact, they will amplify perturbations, and this way they instead diminish perturbations. These ratios were determined by observing patterns in pair barycenter trajectories, not by mere ratio calculations… The patterns slowly rotate…) There is a missing planet between Jupiter and Mars, which are then near (5/2)^2 …

    By far best resonance is between Earth/Venus (8/13 = 5 meet points in cycle…)
    There is a sentence in wiki/Orbital_resonance, that the resonance have got “no dynamical significance”. This is not true – inspecting exact frequency (nHz) of Earth/Venus meet times shows, that perturbations by larger planets exist and they are quickly restored to common meet-time frequency, because when both planets meet, they either attract or slow down other planet. By asserting constant orbit time, the planet is forced to a constant distance from the Sun. (The Mars orbit is much more erratic than Earth’s…)

    There is yet another resonance between Earth and Venus: in 8 years, 13 Venus orbits, there is 12 Venus days. Every time, when both planets meet, Venus shows the same “face” to Earth – it is tidal-locked similar as the Moon, and every time they are in a heliocentric opposition, that same “face” is toward Earth and Sun. This way, the Earth is doubly-stabilised to a constant orbit. IF there was single resonance, both planets could “travel” by perturbations outward toward larger planets (or inward toward Sun?), which is a case of Mars, which is not-that-well stabilised and orbits exactly just below the place, where Jupiter-Saturn barycenter moves and mills the asteroid cleaner belt – remnant of a missing planet… (There are 2 cleaners in the Solar system, one is the asteroid belt and the other is cleaning-disk arround Saturn – because any body, that gets inside, will travel that long, until it crashes into something, and having bodies with large cross-section little helps the chance, that it will not crash to Earth…)

    The outer planets are also stabilised to their far orbits, and the missing planet is there to break the link of larger planets to near planets, so that we are not influenced by them that much. IF this could happen by a random chance, it highly diminishes a probability, that other exo-planet – without this well stabilisation onto a constant orbit, can host life…

    There is another probably-important resonance: the Sun rotates (spins), as you know, and the period is 1 moon (month). The Solar spin is strange (poles slowed down by magnetic linking with largest body in the Solar system – the Heliosphere of solar wind plasma, which it turns into a Parker spiral – the wind does NOT travel like drops from garden-streamer, which travel straight away, the Solar wind instead is more and more deflected by magnetic lines, mostly extending from Solar poles, which are then slowed by this…). The band, where every Sunspot cycle starts – arround 40° heliolatitude, rotates in exact frequency of the Earth vibration (cca 27 days) on its orbit by the Moon counter-balance… The Moon is tuned to the Solar spin – by a chance? Why Mercury, Venus and Mars have lost their protective magnetic field, while Earth has retained it – may it be by re-charging it due to it’s synchronized vibration?

  14. oldbrew says:

    P.A.S: Interesting comments, thanks.

    Re ‘There is yet another resonance between Earth and Venus: in 8 years, 13 Venus orbits, there is 12 Venus days. Every time, when both planets meet, Venus shows the same “face” to Earth – it is tidal-locked similar as the Moon’

    Yes, there’s one extra Venus rotation, i.e. ’70 x 12 plus one’, for every 70 ‘Venus pentagrams’ (70 x 5 Venus-Earth conjunctions).

    Btw 5:12:13 is the proportion of a Pythagoras triangle.
    (5 = V-E, 12 = V(r), 13 = V(o))

  15. oldbrew says:

    54 Chandler wobbles per 64 years looks like a good fit.
    The beat period of the wobble and one year would be 64 / (64-54) = 6.4 years.
    The average wobble interval would be 432.888 days.

  16. […] the Why Phi? – a Mars-Earth model and more post we found a Mars-Earth-Venus period of ~64 years. Note that 64 / 39.58 (basic JVMe period) = […]