The road to net zero – according to BBC Science

Posted: February 10, 2020 by oldbrew in climate, Emissions, Energy, opinion, propaganda, turbines
Tags: , , ,

Enormous expense, twenty times more wind turbines, hydrogen production, much less meat eating, carbon capture, hard ‘lifestyle changes’ and so on. Maybe travel to work on a flying pig – and all for what?

It won’t be easy, but clean energy analyst Chris Goodall believes that the UK is entirely capable of becoming carbon neutral, says BBC Science.

Belatedly, the world has realised it has to eliminate greenhouse gases within a few decades.

The UK has promised ‘net zero’ emissions by 2050. Is this is an achievable aim? How much will it cost? In what ways will our lifestyles need to change?

In summary, the answer to these questions is that reducing carbon emissions sharply is feasible but the change will be expensive and requires hard adjustments to some aspects of our lives.

It will be almost as disruptive as the first Industrial Revolution. But, at the end of the process of decarbonisation, we might reasonably expect to have built a far safer world and a society that is both more prosperous and more equal.

The UK needs to set out a programme of carbon-cutting actions across all parts of today’s society, starting with energy supply but spreading across activities as diverse as agriculture and clothing manufacture.

Many people assume that this country is already well on the route to zero emissions. But the sharp reductions in greenhouse gases that the UK has achieved thus far have almost entirely come from improving electricity supply by switching out of coal and increasing wind and solar power.

This was the easy bit. The challenge now gets far more difficult because we still use carbon-based fuels for about half our electricity supply as well as almost all our other energy needs.

Full article here.

  1. oldbrew says:

    From yesterday’s Daily Telegraph: ‘Why it’s time to put Net Zero to a referendum’

    The economic cost of this could make the most apocalyptic ‘No Deal’ scenarios seem small change – yet the level of detail is astonishingly slight…. [paywalled]

    If anyone still thinks the BBC Science article isn’t totally bonkers:
    It is very uncomfortable to say this, but climate stability is impossible to reconcile with today’s levels of meat-eating.
    . . .
    And at the end of the process we will have low energy costs…

  2. Saighdear says:

    Huh, Being CAPABLE is one thing, One of my cars is capable of doing around 150mph. (on a good day,Tail wind down Shap) nothing fancy about that – but the traffic and REGULATION doesn’t allow here.
    Being CULPABLE is something else. and I’m not. I can live with speed regulation, but I cannot live with Regulation that violate the Laws of Nature. …… All getting FAR beyond a joke.S

  3. Gamecock says:

    You can make a living as a ‘clean energy analyst?’

    ‘Belatedly, the world has realised it has to eliminate greenhouse gases within a few decades.’

    As if the last 35 years never happened?

    And it used to be that we had to eliminate them by 1998. Uhh . . . 2006. Uhh . . . .

    Good to know we now have a few decades.

    The article is a joke. Every paragraph is nonsense.

  4. oldbrew says:

    The challenge now gets far more difficult because we still use carbon-based fuels for about half our electricity supply as well as almost all our other energy needs.

    Which is why it’s all completely unrealistic nonsense.

  5. JB says:

    “Is this is an achievable aim?”

    Should this question need asking? Even if it were, Nature abhors a vacuum. The planet’s biosphere will merely adjust the level of “greenhouse” (an absurd oxymoron) gases to whatever balance it requires.

  6. Jeremy says:

    WHY are we paying for this?

  7. oldbrew says:

    Jeremy – because we invented coal-based power and started the industrial revolution, probably :/
    – – –
    Guardian climate derangement on show again today 😂

    The Guardian Warns of Impending ‘Climate Catastrophe’

    The Guardian has reasserted its role as flagship publication of climate alarmism, warning Monday that entire cities in the UK could be under water by the end of the century.

    Without “urgent action to adapt to and confront global heating,” the Guardian declares, Europe could face “possible forest fires, floods, droughts and deluges” by the year 2100.
    – – –
    We could write their so-predictable climate stories for them. No shortage of imaginary scares to wave in front of their credulous readers.

  8. A C Osborn says:

    If these writers are not being paid lots of money I can only assume that they are totally deranged by what they write.
    They must really hate the UK and the people living here.

  9. pochas94 says:

    Out of the frying pan, into the fire.

  10. cognog2 says:

    The BBC seems determined to destroy its reputation. It is in a bubble.

  11. Saighdear says:

    Auld chinese proverb: when you’re blowing a bubble, don’t stop to draw breath!

  12. oldbrew says:

    It should be called *not zero*. The only zero will be the effect on the climate.

  13. JohnM de France says:


    BBC Studios’ award winning Science Unit announces a brand new series with Swedish environmental activist Greta Thunberg at Showcase 2020 event.

    I am sure that you all will want to watch this /sarc

  14. Gamecock says:

    Oldbrew, they were writing the SAME story 20 years ago.

  15. stpaulchuck says:

    how unethical or unintelligent does one have to be to continue this insane CAGW rubbish? This sort of thing is written by the otherwise unemployable types IMAO.

  16. Phoenix44 says:

    ” …we might reasonably expect to have built a far safer world and a society that is both more prosperous and more equal.”

    Safer? More prosperous? Delusional.

    More equal perhaps m, but as with all.attempts to engineer more equal, that means everybody poorer.

  17. Chaswarnertoo says:

    Dear BBC, FOAD. I will be burning coal to keep warm, running a 5 litre V8 and loads of bonfires.
    Where do you get carbon free fighter jets from?
    These people are insane.

  18. Gamecock says:

    “all.attempts to engineer more equal, that means everybody poorer.”


    “Equality is possible only at the basest level.” – GC

    One could wonder if the drive to the bottom is intentional or accidental, but, in the end, it makes no difference.

  19. P.A.Semi says:

    Well, it’s becoming more grave than just “paying money for something”…

    A recent video, where Bill Gates explains that:

    CO2 is allegedly a complete disaster, literally “extremely bad“, and we “need” to get to “near zero“, by “probably one of these numbers is gona have to get to pretty near to zero”. “First we have population … and if we do really great job on new vaccines, healthcare, reproductive health services … by perhaps ten or fifteen percent” (so does he want to reduce population by a billion people by abuse of healthcare and vaccines and “reproductive illnesses”…?) Then it is cut on sentence “the second factor is services we use“, which despite of picture of an african on the background can be clearly interpreted, that in his equation, the people consuming more services dependent on energy are bigger problem… (Does he want to keep Africans in darkness, or to depopulate northern light people? Well, it is necessary to reduce the Population Chernobyl in Africa, an ecological disaster of removed regulation, chain reaction and exponential growth, probably he just cannot state it openly in present-day political climate…?) This video does not continue, whether he wants to achieve some perpetuum mobile to produce services without energy, or some sci-fi energy source, most of which proved to be unusable, beside nuclear energy, which is clean enough…

    Somehow he missed to mention, how much CO2 consumes green life, and how much it would like to consume, if it could get more…

    CO2 = P x S x E x C

    On left side he wants near zero, and so on right side one of those members must get to near zero also… Either to depopulate those, who consume energy, or invent some perpetuum mobile, or switch to carbon-less energy sources, which beside nuclear ones do not work, and thereby reducing the precious food for plants, which is CO2, probably laying aside those carbon reserves for some future civilization, that would not be that insane and would return the Carbon to the Nature via air…

    That Climate Hoax is an abominable demagogy, which is becoming dangerous, if it wants to depopulate us… (While considering, that we may not breed unrestricted, Africans foremost… The planet is not infinite…)

  20. oldbrew says:

    P.A.Semi says: February 11, 2020 at 5:18 pm
    – – –
    Back to school for Silly Billy G…’basic science’…

    CO2: ignorant people call it a ‘pollutant’ 🙄

    Glucose is a simple sugar with the molecular formula C6H12O6…Glucose is mainly made by plants and most algae during photosynthesis from water and carbon dioxide, using energy from sunlight. [bold added]

  21. Saighdear says:

    This is just another example of what I’ve been saying for years: That those in “possession” of a lot of Power have very little between the Ears. In a mechanical Sens – the greater the horsepower, the less the IQ to do a given job. We see it every day, on the Roads, in the Fields and in the Repair Workshops. The larger the Power at their disposal, the quicker & Easier it is to break things

  22. oldbrew says:

    No let-up in the race to full stupid on climate policy…

    Glasgow COP26: Sturgeon and Gove make climate summit pledge
    1 hour ago

    Mr Gove pointed to the UK’s achievements in cutting emissions so far, but said: “Even as we do celebrate what we’ve achieved, be in no doubt the government recognises there’s so much more we need to do in order genuinely to demonstrate leadership.

    “It is not enough to look at the trajectory in the past. We have to be even more ambitious in the future.”
    – – –
    For ‘ambitious’ read ‘barking mad’.

  23. Kelvin Vaughan says:

    Making people eat less meat and more veg will just transfer methane production from cows to human beings.

  24. P.A.Semi says:

    oldbrew says – February 11, 2020 at 6:30 pm – … photosynthesis…



    I’ve used that at bottom of my page
    There is also a snapshot of RT article citing GreenPeace co-founder Patrick Moore, with a sentence: “CO2 had been declining since the last ice age, with barely enough for the earth’s plant life to sustain itself.”

  25. P.A.Semi says:

    (This is little off-topic in this article, I just didn’t want to have it off-topic in that “why phi” article beside…)

    Can you please publish me an article on Tallbloke’s Talkshop about SC25 start? I tried to reach Rog by e-mail, but he is probably out on vaccation celebrating Br.exit… I’ll try to upload it to arXiv org too, but it’s probable they will censor and reject that, not sure yet…

    The title is “Solar Cycle 25 Started on Remarkable Times“, and it can link either to a html page or possibly to a PDF file (but that may change later to another version…)

    I’d prefer February 12 as a date, since it is a first anniversary of first Sunspot of SC25, according to their magnetic polarity… But it could also be some time later, if it’s submitted too late now… (Possibly even around the “sprout” time in march or april…? I’m not sure now… The more I’m thinking about that, I could possibly consider it released even by this comment for now and an article could come at any time later, as you prefer…)

    That article just forwards a marvelous message from the Sun from God or Angels, because that good match of first sunspots in a new cycle on holidays is absolutely not random…


    Beside that, I’ve published some solar videos on page , if you’ve seen normal mono-channel pictures or videos, this is something different… (I rate myself second best in artistic quality, far after prof. Druckmuller from Brno Technical University, there is a link to his page also… The colors should express temperatures and it combines more EUV channels, theoretic background is on prof. Druckmuller’s page, from which I’ve learned that algorithm…)
    See those two videos below “Probably most active region in SC24”, the right one is probably better… (It’s AVI files for download, there is no web-page player… You can play them in VLC or other player, possibly slowing down or watching them more times… It’s not small files, there is total 1.6Gb in 9 videos, it’s my representative sample “the best of” so far, but including source data it is about 1Tb of files for these and some 10 other shorter videos… Probably do not put links directly to AVI files, since the video files will be uploaded somewhere else later, if there will be too high traffic on them… Or there will be possibly a redirection page…)

    It’s somehow related, since the first short video on that page explains without words, how is a magnetogram linked to visible and EUV sunspots, it’s meant possibly for schools for an explanation…

    There are also two videos “Magnetic Map of Sun”, showing rectangular projection of HMIB and MDI magnetograms with noise filter and far-side interpolated, it’s daily and not one frame per Carrington rotation as usually…
    (There will be a chart of magnetic activity of the Sun with that seeming 27-day frequency removed, and comparing that to planet positions… Some time later, possibly soon…)

    Is it a problem to use AVI format instead of MP4? (I’m not sure…)

    It could make another article, if you like, or I’ll better just try to link and explain them in comment section, but the first one about SC25 is more important now, although it does not look that much appealing…

    (this is from year 2014 from previous cycle 24 secondary maximum)

    I’m not sure, why does word press block me from posting this? (Probably too much hyper-links?) Retrying for third time…

    [mod] went to spam bin, too many links

  26. oldbrew says:

    Scientists unravel mystery of photosynthesis
    Date: February 5, 2020
    Source: DOE/Argonne National Laboratory

    Scientists have solved a critical part of the mystery of photosynthesis, focusing on the initial, ultrafast events through which photosynthetic proteins capture light and use it to initiate a series of electron transfer reactions.

  27. Gamecock says:

    ‘The challenge now gets far more difficult because we still use carbon-based fuels for about half our electricity supply as well as almost all our other energy needs.’

    Y’all should have thought of that before you started the Net Zero 2050 stupidity.

  28. It doesn't add up... says:

    So let’s see… 440GW of wind. At say 40% capacity factor is 1540TWh per year of generation. Present electricity consumption is about 300TWh. That’s probably about the right amount of curtailment required if you are going to do it with wind. So the cost is 5 times the number you first think of. What you do about the rest of the economy is another ball of wax. If there is one, of course.

  29. P.A.Semi says:

    I’ve watched a 42 minute video-lecture “Is it Really the End of the Internal Combustion Engine”, well explaining, why alternatives to petroleum engines are currently insane, high-cost and not effective… (my own words, he explained that better) The electric vehicles just shift the emissions to the power-plants, and mining minerals for batteries is environmentally expensive, and their energy density is not unlimited… etc etc… well explained…

    They or you just forgot, that there is another approach or solution to this: You need not transport that much.

    Most of you live in ugly over-cared regions, crowded streets full of vehicles, because everyone needs to transport somewhere… I live in a country-side village, because I work over internet and it does not matter, where I sit, and nearest forest is few hundred meters of walk distance from here… To go shopping, once in three days I take bicycle and drive to nearest town, because our local village shop is 20% more expensive, because larger market in town has lower costs of transporting their goods there and they give work to less people as shop assistants. But as more goods will be produced by robots, we need to have occupation for people, not working in production sector, to avoid unemployment…

    IF the state was subventing local shops, so that they are not more expensive and give reasonable work to people as shop-assistants, and if their merchandise was distributed rationally via regional stores, then many people could just walk to a nearest shop or drive car few hundred meters instead of driving a car to the nearest town or shopping-mall. I.e., having more small shops distributed locally instead of large shopping centers, where the individual transportation of customers needs to be accounted for in environmental impacts…

    If I order special goods like electronics in e-shop over internet, one van of PPL or DHL etc delivers many such commodities at once, just stopping here and there, and kilometers of transport per buyed commodity are much less, and much less cars would obstruct in streets, and it costs me less personal time…
    If you transported goods and services toward where people are living, people would not need to individually transport, where shops and services are…

    It’s not only a question of energy or air polution, but mainly it is a question of living in pleasant neighbourhoods not jammed by cars, regardless of their fuel costs…

    Also, since many people in west live in small houses in suburb places without infrastructure, they all drive to a city for shopping and culture and everything, they are actually sleeping in rabbit hutches or bunkhouses and drive away to “live” daily elsewhere, unlike in the socialist prefab high houses, which were just among local culture and shopping and we had shops and cinema and culture hall and primary schools and large park all in comfy walk distance, the peope could live there and not just sleep overnight… And to drive into the city center, there is comfortable public transport actually faster and cheaper than driving there by car…

    Then bussiness meetings – if you could make a video-conference, you need not transport bussinessmen there personally, it’s more time-effective and cost-effective, it just needs to change habits a little and get a little better infrastructure for video-conferences…

    Then tourism – if you make sight-seeing over internet, you can see more places, but more shallowly, than travelling there physically… So if you reserved actual personal visit to other regions to exceptional occasions, and made ordinary sight-seeing virtually, you could see more places, and that exceptional occasion would be even more intensive experience, than if you travel every few months here and there…
    Again, it is not only matter of transport energy, but a matter of over-crowded tourist destinations and a lot of air travel…

    So if they say – whatever we do, we can reduce car or plane emissions only by 5%, then no – you could do much better, if people were using those cars and planes much less, because they would not need to transport that much, and it could be made more pleasant for the people and not as a burden… (i.e. do not ban the cars, but make local infrastructure subventions, so that people are more pleasant while not traveling vainly…)

    Or I’m not sure, how happy are you spending hours a day driving on over-crowded streets to over-crowded places? That’s because you do not have infra-structure, shopping and culture and employment, where you live… You don’t have it, because transportation is too easy and centers are more cost-effective for merchants, while they are less cost-effective for you, customers and people… That trend could change slowly back for better of the people, it’s just a matter of a wrong doctrine, that our states may not help that, what is more beneficial for most…
    (The problem is, that Walmart or Tesco etc is cheaper than your local neighbourhood store… That could change more easily, than changing technology of combustion engines… Because their problem is not CO2, but other emissions, dust and noise and over-crowding of streets and centers and many of you just end up living in bunkhouse (sleeping-house) regions without local infrastructure and culture…)
    (Or I’m not sure, if it can be such generalized and what are specific problems of other regions…)

    Then, I do not pass by people here, I meet people here and it’s always worth saying “hello” even if the other one is walking opposite side of the street. Sometimes I rermember a “Crocodile Dundee” film… How many people do you meet on streets in a city, if you just pass by thousands ignoring ones…?

  30. waterside4 says:

    Mr or Mrs P A Semi,
    Great rambling Communist manifesto there.
    I am one of those stupid old fashioned people who like to make up my own mind on how i wish to spend my time and money doing how i like to live my life.

  31. oldbrew says:

    Getting madder by the week…

    Petrol and diesel car sales ban could start in 12 years, says Shapps
    4 hours ago

    The UK’s planned ban on sales of new petrol, diesel or hybrid cars could start as early as 2032, Transport Secretary Grant Shapps has said.

    Last week, the government sparked industry concern after bringing the date forward from 2040 to 2035 in a bid to hit zero-carbon emission targets.

    But Mr Shapps told BBC Radio 5 live it would happen by 2035, “or even 2032,” adding there would be consultation.

    The SMMT car trade body had previously said the 2035 figure was “concerning”.

  32. oldbrew says:

    Europe’s Green Deal: Same Hysteria, Same Destruction

    ‘Today’s brand of the left-leaning politician is all about substituting what sounds good for what actually works. Modern politics, whether in the U.S. or Europe, is about taking a chainsaw to everything that produced even a modicum of success to appease the deities espousing progressive orthodoxy. There is no better example of this than fossil fuels, energy sources that have lifted us out of destitution and darkness and given us incredible wealth the world had never witnessed. What is the left interested in doing? Confiscation, cronyism, centralization, and coercion to combat climate change. The European Union will achieve these objectives through the boondoggle-in the-making Green Deal.’

  33. Gamecock says:

    Pikers! Ban cars NEXT WEEK!

  34. P.A.Semi says:

    waterside4 says – February 12, 2020 at 7:00 pm

    Mr or Mrs P A Semi
    I often recognize a man by his writing… Sometimes it’s not clear enough… Well, I’m a man born in 70’s of last century, not yet 50 years old…

    Great rambling Communist manifesto there.
    No, it’s national socialist and an economic patriotism… Do you understand, what does it really mean “We The People” ?
    (If you’d like to tell me, it’s just a title of some constitution, then you didn’t think about it enough…)

    I am one of those stupid old fashioned people who like to make up my own mind on how i wish to spend my time and money doing how i like to live my life.

    Did I say you cannot ? I suggested State should Help someone to become more competitive, because overall costs would be reduced by that. Presently, Tesco is cheaper, because it brings one large truckload of goods and does not account for customer driving expenses, while small village or suburb shops are more expensive, but customer’s driving expenses are smaller. So if a society is wise enough, it can Help that, what is Beneficial, to become more competitive economically against predators like Tesco or Walmart, which are not beneficial…

    Is there any suggestion on limiting someone or banning something?

    If you see some Trend in a Society, you should think, how to orient or redirect it a better way, and it’s often more expedient to make the better way more attractive, than trying to ban the wrong way…

    As you write: “spend my time and money doing how i like” – but collectively all your motorism harms people by noise and polution and overcrowding streets and city centers. It would even be justified, if you paid a reasonable tax for driving, which could help subventing those local shops. (You already pay a tax from gasoline… Because your actions like driving cause costs for the society, it’s quite fair if you pay for that proportionately… And that still leaves you with a freedom of choice, just some choices are made more profitable and some less, it should be balanced to regulate the undesired trends to some extent… Try to extrapolate present trends some 20-30 years into future, how the growing motorism and transportation would be more and more a burden on the society…)

    As Oldbrew above mentions “centralization”, that my thesis “February 12, 2020 at 6:33 pm” is about economic decentralization, to make more advantageous local shops and culture with a help of State, which State is or should be We The People collectively, while centralized it is presently more than enough in hands of few unelected Cartels…

    A Wise Society Regulates it’s Trends, it’s just insane to let it all go unhinged because of some bad economic theories, that started to be more and more harmful…

    It’s like for example a Family. If We and the State need more children with good upbringing, it should encourage and support good Families better. Does it mean it should ban or harm others? No… Equality is very dangerous demagogy and lie. We are not equal, we are unique (and others are unique also, it does not contradict), and something is better than something else, and the better should be helped, and the bad should be vilified. But the liars now vilify the better and help the wrong, in order that “sane” people defend and strive for at least that equality, like “no, we white people are not worse than black ones, we are not racist, we are all equal”… No, we are not equal… While Racism is Love of your Neighbours, second most important commandment (Mt22:3 literally – “Love your neighbour similar as you” or “αγαπησεις τον πλησιον σου ως σεαυτον” , with a reference to Lv19:18-19, that evidently bans race-mixing and ethnic mixing in just the following verse…), then Anti-Racism is just Hate and Treason. And Family is better than Singles, and Straight is better than Perverse… Claiming either of the opposites, like “all are same”, or “perverse is better than straight”, are just lies, which lead the society to an abyss of moral decline.

    εγω ειμι I AM a christian, and a right-wing national democratic socialist (or “societalist”?). That means, that we the people of this or that region or nation should collectively decide, what is better for us, and then how to make it work better.
    Then Supranational Communism or rather a Burreaucratic Totality is just a rule of un-elected burreaucrats in some far center not connected to the people, and Globalist Capitalism is just a rule of un-elected economic Elite in some far who-knows-where, also not connected to the people, and so these systems are just kindred.
    It was a deception of Bankster Predators like Soros, who Bought the Left and turned it into completely insane lunatics, defending Globalism against Democracy, and sticked on it a label “socialism”, so that you do not understand the “society” enough… Think on it for a while, why the biggest bankster globalist “capitalists” assist that wrong and intentionally insane version of so called “socialism”?!
    (As a side-note, for a “Society” is absolutely not beneficial to prefer wrong or harmful minorities against straight majority… That is just their deception…)
    Your old labels of “capitalism” or “communism” or “socialism” have been heavily mis-used and overturned to opposites just to hinder the right way, and so that all are just confused…

    And why the oligarchs, probably connected to profits from oil bussiness and transportation, started that Great Climatic Lie of CO2 “harms”, just to make you defend – “no no, all motorism is harmless and cannot be reduced”… It seems, that on multiple fields (((they))) tried this strategy of intensely promoting some partial lie or seemingly opposite of their goals just to make people defend the opposite of what would be more beneficial for them…

    And back to transportation environmental and societal costs – if we concluded, that our transportation is burden on environment and on us growing ever heavier, then our Tool the State should help us not being in so dire need of that much transportation… That would be quite friendly, instead of some prescripts or a desire of unreal technologies helping us continue on a wrong way… (And as a side-note, I am from a small nation, which is among two, where car manufacturing makes most significant part of economy (16%), so by this lobbying against excessive transportation I am against my own interests indirectly…)

    I apologize for turning a physics-oriented blog comment into a political talk…

  35. Gamecock says:

    “You need not transport that much.”

    Eat me. I like coffee. I like Heering Cherry in my Singapore slings. I like asparagus all year round. NEED has FA to do with it.

    “Most of you live in ugly over-cared regions”

    Eat me. You have no fvcking idea where I live.

    “crowded streets full of vehicles”


    “because everyone needs to transport somewhere”

    I transported my ass to the gym and back this afternoon. In my Shelby GT350R. Enjoyed every freaking second of it.

    Soviet blockhouses is the solution, eh?

  36. oldbrew says:

    all about substituting what sounds good for what actually works

    That’s where we’re going. Hard to see it being a success, either in terms of what the goal is supposed to be or in terms of people liking the actual outcome – which is likely to be a different matter.

  37. oldbrew says:

    Talking up hydrogen…

    FEBRUARY 12, 2020

    Australia’s Chief Scientist: We need to transform our world into a sustainable ‘electric planet’
    by Alan Finkel, The Conversation


  38. P.A.Semi says:

    oldbrew says: February 13, 2020 at 8:57 am
    » Costs?

    Do you mean those digits or papers, that FED can print in any amount?
    Or real costs, that may not be that negligible?

    Because there are two types of costs… Many of their environmental policies do have real burdensome environmental and societal costs and are insane… Some may be beneficial, if it was done wise… Some may look beneficial and harmless at first, until they are tried and we start to consider recycling costs too, like those wind turbines…

    But it’s good to ask about costs in advance, some “scientists” are too unheedful of reality, and some “investors” just do not tell you, how they intend to mine their rente from that…

    Gamecock says: February 13, 2020 at 3:30 am
    » You have no fvcking idea where I live.

    Okay, I understand that many could choose, where and how they desire to live… Some were just forced by circumstances into something they would not choose, if they could choose otherwise…

    By that “most of you” I was meaning western or “civilized” people generally…

    Regarding that “over-cared regions”, I now live by the main street in this village, and there goes about 1-3 cars per minute during day-time (in the morning there is probably bigger traffic, something like 5-10 cars per minute? there is a street connecting nearby towns here…), and during warm part of the year there are birds singing, and mostly I hear, if someone is walking the street, when I stand in front of house in touch distance from nearest tree. After 10pm, you do not see anyone walking outdoor, and at midnight, the street-lamps switch off and you can see stars, if the sky is clear, there goes about 1-2 cars per hour, and loudest sound is water flowing in the nearby brook…

    In the nearby town, even in the peak traffic hours like friday afternoon, I need to wait just some time something like ten or twenty seconds before the street is sufficiently clear to cross it wherever I just decide…

    Of cause there are larger cities in this country, the capital is over-crowded as usual on the West… (I’m not a typical village-man, since I moved here from the capital city via some smaller district-center town, now I’m living in a countryside village, working over internet…)

    Most of you became accustomed to ugly over-crowded cities and do not understand any more, what is wrong with that, or rather what was better with the former…

    While understanding that many or just not few chose better, when they could… But that Trend of people moving toward large centers and living on suburbs and driving to cities for work, while the country-side is being depopulated, is remarkable…

    » Soviet blockhouses is the solution, eh?
    You did not live there, I did, when I was young… Some were accusing these of mere bunkhouses (sleeping-houses), but rather present wide suburbs around cities with small houses in gardens without any infrastructure, these are just bunkhouses. Now in most suburbs there is no culture, no shopping, no primary school in walk distance, and no park in walk distance. Because the infrastructure would not be profitable for too few people living in walk-distance of them, and if people drive cars, they can drive to nearby city center, so they just return home for sleeping, but they live in nearby city…

    Here in a village with 600 inhabitants, there is shop, two pubs and a culture hall, and a football stadium with a swimming pool. (And there is a medieval church…) That would absolutely not be profitable to build, but in 1970’s there was “socialist” program of “Action Z” (that “Z” meant “improve”, but people were calling it “gratis”), that state was paying for construction materials and people were working for free on weekends and afternoons, more or less voluntarily. (It was voluntary, but if one didn’t came, then neighbours asked: “hey comrade, why didn’t you come building with us?!”) You may claim something about slave labour, but they were instead building infrastructure for themselves, that would not be commercially realizable… And the shop is not any profitable, the village is subventing it, because grannies have it more complicated to drive to nearby town… (there goes few busses a day and there is a train-station, but if you could just walk to the shop, it’s better… well, most people have a car here, there is just few bicyclists like me, but still most people who drive for work drive just 3km to nearby town or 10km to nearby district center, but there is also agriculture work and some woodcraft manufactures here in the village…)

    So if you wanted to have people living near cities, the higher houses allow for placing infrastructure (shop, culture-hall, school, playground, park) just at their reach, while on wide suburbs with small houses there is relatively none… But it may be better to allow people returning to the country-side, back into touch with nature and fields…

  39. oldbrew says:

    Small Town – American style…’they roll the sidewalks up come around sundown’
    [after 20 sec. ad]

    John David Anderson (born December 13, 1954, in Apopka, Florida) is an American country musician with a successful career that has lasted more than 40 years. Starting in 1977 with the release of his first single, “I’ve Got a Feelin’ (Somebody’s Been Stealin’)”, Anderson has charted more than 40 singles on the Billboard country music charts, including five number ones: “Wild and Blue”, “Swingin'”, “Black Sheep”, “Straight Tequila Night”, and “Money in the Bank”.

  40. Gamecock says:

    “Seminole Wind” is electric. [old video – not HD]

  41. oldbrew says:

    Gamecock – yes, got two of his CDs somewhere. But we digress 😎

  42. ivan says:

    P.A.Semi, it appears you are advocating the slave camps sustainable cities of the UN Agenda 21 and Agenda 30 manifesto – not a good outcome for the people of the world.

  43. P.A.Semi says:

    oldbrew says: February 13, 2020 at 3:14 pm
    » Small Town – American style…

    That is precisely what I’ve been writing about… They were actually more Happy living there. Life was little calmer, but full of various family and real-life happiness, and living in touch with nature…
    People overcrowded in cities should realize, what they are missing while not even remembering that…

    About the video – there is not a single black man in it… Which is right, because global diversity, that really is beautiful, means, that here live such people and there live different people. Asia for Asians, Africa for Africans, Europe for Europeans… In USA it is already mixed, but still there are truly diverse regions, that means different from other places. If you mix all people together, in every place similar mixture, then the global diversity is irreversibly lost, nowhere nothing specific, everywhere a same ugly mixture… (Loo’n’den is a primary example of totally spoiled place…) Do you know, why there are still white and black people in USA after four centuries of living together? Because all that time you were healthy racists and were not race-mixing, so there still can be black people until today and not a mixture of arab-like mulates… Because only healthy racists can live side-by-side and not get mixed into one gray mud…

    But then what? Just today there is an article about your w00fter candidate: “Buttigieg Reveals Plan to Flood Small U.S. Towns With Immigration to ‘Renew’ Populations”. That is similar to what I said but with an OPPOSITE intent. I meant returning people from spoiled cities back to the nature. But this man is intending to spoil the country-side same, as are ethnically spoiled the cities… With foreign alien population… Then, you do not have got Democracy, you have got Demography, and it is working slowly against you, because the inferior ones breed faster, regardless of race…

    That sowing of ethnic divide is precisely, what enables them their Tyranny. Consider Belgium, there are Vlames and Valones, two different nations with two different languages. And they vote against each other, not choosing left or right policy etc, but choosing OUR national candidates against THEIR national candidates. Then there is nothing the people really decide by elections and you could just count the people of various ethnicities and place un-elected burreaucrats with due ethnic representation to ‘okay’ the will of oligarchs…

    It’s little similar in USA, where you had a White candidate Trump against Spoiling Mixture candidate Clinton, it was partially just an ethnic fight for survival and you have almost no saying in actual Trump’s policies… (I know it was little more complicated and not only an ethnic choice… And he is still by far better than any current alternative. I just hope the Americans won’t be that stupid to allow to seat on the most powerful throne on this planet some monster like Clinton or this current bugger they’re scamming in through election frauds like recently in Iowa primaries…)

    The Leftist Lieberals in USA are totally unhinged now. They even don’t choose a candidate of Leftist Order, which is Sanders, but they choose a candidate of Chaos and Destruction, as was Hillary or other anti-patriarchate whores now, just to get a non-man elected… (And Tulsi Gabbard, the most honest of the Left, they’ve rejected outright, because the leftists are dishonest foremost, but neither she is fit to be a president, because she is nice but weak woman just playing strong, but would be a good puppet in ruling oligarch hands, because women are more easily manipulated from behind the scenes, and women are usually not capable of selecting the Lesser Evil now, they try to select No Evil now, bringing Worse Evil later… Presidential elections is not a Beauty Contest… And Tulsi Gabbard is a good congresswoman, but is unfit for President post…) By placing a Woman to the contest, they try to sow a gender divide, so that half of the population votes a man and half of the population votes a woman, and the ballance tip is easily skewed by some frauds. Consider, that choosing some tyrannical policies by 51:49 margin is never right… Good enough the american women last time realized, that a Strong Man protects them better, than a Bigmouth Gangster Harridan…

    (sorry if some words are not appropriate, I’m looking them up in dictionary… Maybe “hellcat” is better word than “harridan”, while speaking about HRC ?)

    Aristotle writes in Philia (which means “brotherly love”) about democracy: “democracy is possible only within homogenous ethnic groups, while despots have always reigned over highly fragmented societies. A multi-ethnic society is thus necessarily anti-democratic and chaotic, for it lacks philia, this profound, flesh-and-blood fraternity of citizens. Tyrants and despots divide and rule, they want the City divided by ethnic rivalries. The indispensable condition for ensuring a people’s sovereignty accordingly resides in its unity. Ethnic chaos prevents all philia from developing.”
    And since in USA you almost overcame that Ethnic Divide with a National Patriotism, so they are striving to bring in un-patriotic foreign people from elsewhere to re-establish that division for conquering you with a tyranny…

    ivan says: February 13, 2020 at 9:33 pm
    » “advocating the slave camps sustainable cities of the UN Agenda 21 and Agenda 30 manifesto

    That’s not right… When will you realize, that they do something else they claim to do? And that they either mix good things with rejectable things to make them rejected all, or to pass through the rejectable with the desired, or they even seemingly strive for an opposite of their real intent to cause you opposing that and thereby to do, what they really intended ?
    When will you realize, that your large megapolies are not only unsustainable, but also unpleasant…?

    Then, recently I thought about a solution for ghettos of inferior unemployed people, that are here and there… They don’t have got any meaning in their life, and they do not have any employment, because no one is interested in buying their possible manufacture production… And these same people were living much better lives in socialist times, when there was a forced employment, they were living in normal houses and going to work and were living similar as normal citizens. But we do not want any forced employment any more…
    But then, for these hopeless people, the state could subsidize manufactures, so that they can get a reasonable employment and a meaning for their lives and a chance to improve from their inferior level…
    And if no one is interested in buying their production, then one part may assemble something and the other part may dismantle that, and time by time it will produce skilled workers for real employment, but all time it will give some employment to otherwise unemployable…
    (Which is a solution for gypsy ghettos here and possibly for other ghettos like Detroit brown unemployed population…) And again, there should be no forcing people into that work, but an offer to help them, more so if their work is not economically profitable…

  44. P.A.Semi says:

    Because you don’t help so much a hungry man by giving him a fish, but much better by teaching him fishing…

    That is same with “gibsmedats“, you don’t help people that much by just giving them free money and not giving them a Sense in their life, you better help those people, if you give them some Work, because that way they will slowly improve, while giving them free money just makes them slowly rot…

    And what is it good for, if all will be produced by robots, while people will have no constructive Sense in their lives?
    Don’t allow Them making You meaningless…

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